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do I have to wash twice after I was excused and still need to wash for Hamotzy as well

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Well thats it. Can I just wash once and recite both brochos. I'm not sure in which order I would do them but I suppose I would do Asher Yotzar first. Or do have to wash twice


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    What does kiddush has to do with anything? - Dov FJul 17  '12 at 20:42
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    Em, not sure. Maybe cos thats when this Shaaleh always crops up? Will edit it anyway - disgruntledGoatJul 17  '12 at 20:47
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    why dont you ask a rov - gadol hadorSep 12  '12 at 00:10
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4 answers!

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Not sure if what im doing is correct, but i wash, make an Asher Yotzar, I then (like Eitza said) touch my hair or something and wash for Netilas Yadayim. i'm almost sure that i heard one Paskan (dont quote me) that one can wash each hand once, make the Asher Yotzar and then wash each hand a second time for Netilas Yadayim. Can someone confirm one way or another?

Btw, speaking of Netilas Yadayim, has anyone ever stopped to think about the Koach of Chazal that's reflecting from Netilas Yadayim? Think about it...

a)מן התורה its not possible to be partially טמא, is either the whole body or none. The Halucha of סתם ידיים (as in only the hands are טמא) is from the Chazal

b)סתם ידיים is שני לטומאה

c)חולין can only become a ראשון לטומאה, which means that סתם ידיים can not be מטמא חולין to make it a שלישי לטומאה (not even if it was תרומה only קודש).

d)חולין does not need to be eaten בטהרה especially in nowadays (whereטומאה וטהרה is for the most part not enforced)

e)If one chooses to eat חולין בטהרה, they would need to wash for all foods, not only bread

f)The VERY same piece of bread can make contact with an אב הטומאה (Nida or a dead bug) which actually CAN make the bread a ראשון לטומאה, but that doesn't concern us, nor are we even attempting to be careful, but we ARE concerned with סתם ידיים which can never make the bread טמא.

g)Considering all this, we still make a Brucha B'shem u'malchus!

There's a famous story of a מסור a big בעל עבירה who observed ONLY the Mitzvah of Netilas Yadayim. One day, "on his way" to a מסורה, he wanted to eat bread, but he could not find water for Netilas Yadayim, the hours moved along, but he could still not find water for Netilas Yadayim. The man refused to eat the bread without Netilas Yadayim and as a result he ended up dead (from starvation). As he died it was announced that because the Masures Nefesh for Netilas Yadayim, he is a ben Olam Haba (or will go to Gan Eidan, dont remember). Imagine....

How amazingly amazing the Chazal were with there Koach Hatorah! Think about it the next time you wash your hands for Netilas Yadayim.


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    So you saying similar to what Eitzah Geber said. By the way facinating story - disgruntledGoatJul 19  '12 at 20:05
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    Maybe, kinda, he suggested washing first without a Keli and then with a Keli, i didnt. - YossiJul 19  '12 at 20:11
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    oh i get it! doesnt Asher Yotzar need twice on each hand different to Al Netillas Yodayim? - disgruntledGoatJul 19  '12 at 20:42
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    So the "washing once" part i'm not sure, im almost sure i heard such a Pasak, but i am not certain. Im hoping someone can clarify. The first thing i said is that i wash with a Kila both times but touch my hair between the two washes. - YossiJul 20  '12 at 01:44
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This is a Mefurashe Simon in Shulcah Oruch. Orach Chaim 165 speaks about this case in full. He brings two Shittos. The first is to make 2 brochos and the second Shittoh is to make Asher Yotzar while cleaning your hands and and afterwards Al NeTillas Yodayim whilst you dry your hands.


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R. Yitzchak Abadi rules that one should wash once and first say al netilas yadayim and then asher yatzar.


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1   sounds good to me! Would that be a Safardi Psak? - disgruntledGoatJul 17  '12 at 20:57
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1   No; he regularly paskens for ashkenazim (I am ashkenaz), and if there is a difference he says so. - Dov FJul 17  '12 at 21:01
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1   Thanks for making that clear! - disgruntledGoatJul 17  '12 at 21:35
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1   @YehudaHaMaccabi I don't have the teshuva in front of me but I would assume he holds like the opinion mentioned in the MB 165:1 in the sentence beginning with ודע. It's a big machlokes. As I said, this is how he rules. - Dov FJul 18  '12 at 15:47
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    Who is R'Yitzhcok Abadi (if you dont mind me asking) - disgruntledGoatJul 17  '12 at 20:48
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I always thought that you were supposed to wash under the tap (in which case you would not be qualified to make the bracha 'al netilas') then say Asher Yotzar. Step 2 would be to then touch a usually covered part of the body, thus requiring ones hands to be washed again, and then to proceed with washing with a keli, and continue as one would normally. But then again I often get things in halacha quite wrong, so maybe its better not to follow my advice.


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